re: [RRG] yetAnotherProposal: AS-number forwarding

[Peter Sherbin <pesherb@yahoo.com>]

> IMO, the strict and full hierarchy in locator namespace is not a good idea as
> it will limit the flexibility of address assignment and the efficiency of
> address utilization.

Not necessarily. One would assign flat names which are free to move anywhere.
Address rigid (geo) hierarchy would extend to Tier 1/2 ISP level with a full freedom
for addressing access points below. Thus aggregating access points becomes an ISP
task fitting into the pre-determined global hierarchy.

In this context "abandoning of the existing Internet" means in thinking about the
new architecture, with the intent is to free minds from legacy. When the new design
is done incorporating the existing Internet into it becomes a routine exercise.
Thank you for pointing that out.

Thanks,

Peter

--- Xu Xiaohu <xuxh@huawei.com> wrote:

> 
> 
> > -----é?®ä»¶å??件-----
> > å??件人: Peter Sherbin [mailto:pesherb@yahoo.com]
> > å??é??æ?¶é?´: 2008å¹´3æ??10æ?¥ 14:20
> > �件人: Xu Xiaohu; 'Lixia Zhang'; 'Lars Westberg'
> > æ??é??: rrg@psg.com
> > 主�: re: [RRG] yetAnotherProposal: AS-number forwarding
> > 
> > > The last approach is to introduce an independent host id namespace and uses
> > > a whole GIRO address as locator.
> > >
> > > Which one do you prefer? Or you have any other better idea?
> > 
> > ID/Loc split comes in various forms over and over again with people seem to
> > concentrate on a soft transition of the current system into a scalable one with
> > a
> > minimal disruption. As prudent as it sounds it might not yield anticipated
> > benefits.
> > More desirable approach is to abandon the current Internet entirely and build
> > a new
> > one from two independent, separately managed pools of id: a locator pool and
> > a name
> > pool, where names move freely around a rigid hierarchy of locators.
> 
> I basically agree with your idea of two independent, separately managed pools of
> id and locator namespace, but I don't like the idea of abandoning the current
> Internet entirely. 
> 
> The IPv4 address can still be used well as a local locator, not global locator,
> with an appendix of locator domain (LD) prefix/ID. For example, there are multiple
> LDs in the world, each LD can use independent IPv4 address space, different LD
> only exchange LD prefix/ID information with each other, in this way, there are at
> least three benefits: 1) the address depletion issue is solved; 2) the route
> stability is improved greatly since the route churn in one LD will not be flooded
> into other LDs and the LD-prefix can even be aggregated further; 3) the deployment
> cost is relatively low since only the LD border routers need to be upgraded and
> the most internal routers within LD can still be IPv4-enabled router. The LD
> prefix/ID is strictly hierarchical and topology-dependant, or even
> geographical-location related (see GIRO). This is some idea of HRA.
> 
> IMO, the strict and full hierarchy in locator namespace is not a good idea as it
> will limit the flexibility of address assignment and the efficiency of address
> utilization. 
> 
> Best wishes,
> Xiaohu XU
> 
> > > > -----��¼ï¿½�­ï¿½ï¿½-----
> > > > ������: owner-rrg@psg.com
> [mailto:owner-rrg@psg.com]
> > ����
> > Lixia Zhang
> > > > �����±ï¿½ï¿½:
> 2008��3��10�� 12:22
> > > > ��¼ï¿½ï¿½ï¿½: Lars Westberg
> > > > ����: rrg@psg.com
> > > > ����: Re: [RRG] yetAnotherProposal: AS-number forwarding
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Mar 9, 2008, at 11:40 PM, Lars Westberg wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi,
> > > > > I haven't had time to make a draft but I think it make sense for the
> > > > > discussion. However, I don't know if it already have been discussed
> > > > > so....
> > > > >
> > > > > The proposal are simple: re-use AS-numbers into the forwarding of
> > > > > packets such that prefixes could be aggregated per AS. One simple
> > > > > implemetation is that the packets are tunneled and that the tunnel-
> > > > > address is associated to a AS-number. The AS-numbers can be assigned
> > > > > to the IP-addresses by DNS or by define a small address-prefix to AS-
> > > > > numbers.
> > > > >
> > > > > Comments?
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > in an ideal world, yes having AS number as part of address used for
> > > > routing has great benefit.  see the slide from a talk in 2006
> > > > (http://www.cs.ucla.edu/~lixia/0612Australia.pdf
> > > > , but ignoring the title), slide 17 & 18 is about this.
> > > > If we had a chance to influence address structure, you'd want to
> > > > include other info in addition to AS (as large ASes span large areas,
> > > > TE would want more info to do better job).
> > > > we have another paper (http://www.cs.ucla.edu/~rveloso/papers/
> > > > giro.pdf) showing the benefit for including location info (which
> > > > should be a subfield after AS number)
> > >
> > > With support of routing aggregation at any desired level, I can't image that
> > > GIRO alone can do much help in routing scalability issue unless it brings
> > in
> > > some id/locator split idea, like GSE, SIX/ONE or HRA.
> > >
> > > The first approach is to split the GIRO address into two parts: id and
> > > locator. In this approach, IPv4 address part in GIRO address is used as id,
> > > which means there is no need to change the hosts however it doesn't address
> > > the IPv4 address depletion issue. From this perspective, it's much like eFIT
> > > or LISP but it introduces a new locator space.
> > >
> > > The second approach is to make hosts to negotiate the bunch of several GIRO
> > > addresses.
> > >
> > > The last approach is to introduce an independent host id namespace and uses
> > > a whole GIRO address as locator.
> > >
> > > Which one do you prefer? Or you have any other better idea?
> > >
> > > Best wishes,
> > > Xiaohu XU
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
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> > >
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
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