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Re: RV: I-D ACTION:draft-baker-v6ops-end2end-00.txt
Clue accepted ;-)
A new document has been submitted (attached for those that want to start
commenting already).
Regards,
Jordi
> De: Fred Baker <fred@cisco.com>
> Responder a: <owner-v6ops@ops.ietf.org>
> Fecha: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:47:02 -0700
> Para: <jordi.palet@consulintel.es>
> CC: "v6ops@ops.ietf.org" <v6ops@ops.ietf.org>
> Asunto: Re: RV: I-D ACTION:draft-baker-v6ops-end2end-00.txt
>
> On Aug 15, 2005, at 2:25 PM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote:
>> Overall, agree with your conclusions about 3.3, but I think there
>> is one more scenario, which is the one that we are facing, and
>> seems to me the right way to go, actually the natural one, being
>> deployed with some of our customers.
>>
>> ,---. ,---.
>> / \ / \
>> / \ / \
>> ; IPv4+6 : ; IPv4+6 :
>> | Network | | Network |
>> : +----+---. ,---. ,---. ,---+----+ ;
>> \ |GW-A| \ / \ / \ / |GW-D| /
>> \ +----+ +----+ \ / +----+ +----+ /
>> `---' ; IPv6 |GW-B| IPv4 : ; IPv4 |GW-C| IPv6 : `---'
>> | Network+----+ + | | + +----+Network |
>> ,---. :Transition : IPv6 : : IPv6 ,---.
>> / +----+A / \ B / \ C / \ D+----+ \
>> / |GW-A| / \ / \ / \ |GW-D| \
>> ; IPv4+6+----+--' `---' `---' `--+----+IPv4+6 :
>> | Network | | Network |
>> : ; : ;
>> \ / \ /
>> \ / \ /
>> `---' `---'
>>
>> Network A and D are IPv6-only, with GW-A and GW-B taking care of
>> the v4-in-v6 tunneling, automatically.
>
> There are certainly cases in which a consistent transition strategy
> is being followed and is working. I think I said something in the
> document about granting that the use of a single consistent strategy
> that works will probably work :^).
>
> What I am concerned about is the proliferation of inconsistent
> strategies, and the set of cases I can come up with in which they do
> not work. That is the issue I am trying to raise.
>
>> One more comment. I've discovered a lot of confusion in several
>> documents regarding 6over4 and 6in4, which is being followed by
>> confusing documents from vendors. I think is very important to make
>> a general recommendation, may be not just to this WG, but in
>> general to all the IETF documents which mention tunneling, to
>> clearly make a distinction between both mechanisms, probably
>> avoiding using "over" when actually is referring 6in4
>> encapsulation. Not sure if this should be raised at IESG level or
>> whatever. What do you think ?
>
> What you expect clue? :^)
>
> Yes, it would be good if people would say clueful things in a clueful
> way. There is probably room for an internet draft on the subject.
>
Internet Engineering Task Force J. Palet
Internet-Draft Consulintel
Expires: April 19, 2006 October 16, 2005
6in4 versus 6over4 terminology
draft-palet-v6ops-6in4-vs-6over4-00.txt
Status of this Memo
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This Internet-Draft will expire on April 19, 2006.
Copyright Notice
Copyright (C) The Internet Society (2005).
Abstract
This document clarifies the existing terminology confusion among
references to IPv6/IPv4 encapsulations and IPv4/IPv6 transition
mechanisms.
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Table of Contents
1. Introduction . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3
2. Definition of 'in' and 'over' . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4
3. Conclusions and Future Consistency . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4
4. Security Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5
5. IANA Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5
6. Acknowledgements . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5
7. References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5
7.1. Normative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5
7.2. Informative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6
Author's Address . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7
Intellectual Property and Copyright Statements . . . . . . . . . . 8
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1. Introduction
A number of IETF documents have used in an "interchangeable" way
several expressions such as:
o 6in4
o 6-in-4
o IPv6-in-IPv4
o IPv6 in IPv4
o 6over4
o 6-over-4
o IPv6-over-IPv4
o IPv6 over IPv4
o 4in6
o 4-in-6
o IPv4-in-IPv6
o IPv4 in IPv6
o 4over6
o 4-over-6
o IPv4-over-IPv6
o IPv4 over IPv6
Note that this list is not exhaustive and many other similar
expressions may be also in use. For example, in some situations
other encapsulating layers are used (i.e., 6/UDP/4), and similar
expressions are being used.
As a consequence, documents from vendors, product manuals,
publications, papers, books, tutorials, training material and many
others, use also those expressions.
However not all those documents, including the IETF ones, are
actually referring to the same IPv6/IPv4 encapsulations or IPv4/IPv6
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transition mechanisms.
The result of this terminology confusion is a number of errors among
vendors, operators, engineers and users when designing and
documenting products, or when setting up transition mechanisms,
creating at the end unnecessary operational costs, specially for
beginners which try to setup IPv6 for their first occasions.
2. Definition of 'in' and 'over'
IP in IP Tunneling was defined by [1]. Afterwards [2], obsoleted by
[3], defines the basic IPv4/IPv6 transition mechanisms, including the
encapsulation of IPv6 packets in IPv4 ones (by means of protocol 41);
this document is being updated as "ietf-v6ops-mech-v2".
Similarly, [4], defines the encapsulation of IPv4 packets in IPv6
ones.
A first conclusion can be extracted from this documents (even if some
of them actually use, some times, "over"): Those encapsulation
mechanisms are the ones that should use the "in" terminology. Note
that they are just encapsulation mechanisms, which often are used by
several transition mechanisms.
Furthermore, [5] specify a transition mechanism, which uses 6in4
(encapsulation of IPv6 packets in IPv4 ones), creating a virtual IPv6
link over an IPv4 multicast infrastructure. This transition
mechanism is named as "6over4".
Clearly, "6in4" and "6over4" are quite different things, actually
6over4 is a transition mechanism which uses 6in4 as the procedure for
encapsulating IPv6 packets in IPv4 multicast infrastructures.
The fact that they are different things and specially the requirement
for a (IPv4) multicast infrastructure for 6over4, makes necessary to
clarify the difference and avoid confusions among both.
Engineers operating networks and their customers (for example when
setting up tunnels), often do not read all the IETF documents, so
they could easily misunderstand if a tunnel is "6over4" or "6in4"
(specially when vendor documents use both terms to actually name
"6in4", possibly because the misusage of those terms in [2], [3]),
and this creates some extra troubleshooting time and confusion.
3. Conclusions and Future Consistency
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In order to avoid this kind of confusion, it should be understood the
difference between 6over4 and 6in4 (and any other equivalent
terminologies), and future documents (including IETF ones) must take
this in consideration when republished.
Moreover, new documents which describe other encapsulations and
protocols, such as IPv4 in IPv6, IPv6 in UDP/IPv4, IPv6 in IPv6, must
also use, for consistency reasons, "in" instead of "over".
It is recommended that any existing documents are amended ASAP to
avoid the existing confusion.
4. Security Considerations
This document does not have any protocol-related security
considerations.
5. IANA Considerations
This document does not have any specific IANA considerations.
6. Acknowledgements
The author would like to acknowledge the inputs of ...
7. References
7.1. Normative References
[1] Simpson, W., "IP in IP Tunneling", RFC 1853, October 1995.
[2] Gilligan, R. and E. Nordmark, "Transition Mechanisms for IPv6
Hosts and Routers", RFC 1933, April 1996.
[3] Gilligan, R. and E. Nordmark, "Transition Mechanisms for IPv6
Hosts and Routers", RFC 2893, August 2000.
[4] Conta, A. and S. Deering, "Generic Packet Tunneling in IPv6
Specification", RFC 2473, December 1998.
[5] Carpenter, B. and C. Jung, "Transmission of IPv6 over IPv4
Domains without Explicit Tunnels", RFC 2529, March 1999.
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7.2. Informative References
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Author's Address
Jordi Palet Martinez
Consulintel
San Jose Artesano, 1
Alcobendas - Madrid
E-28108 - Spain
Phone: +34 91 151 81 99
Fax: +34 91 151 81 98
Email: jordi.palet@consulintel.es
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