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Re: The IPv4 Internet MTU



On 10-okt-2007, at 22:51, Brian E Carpenter wrote:

On 2007-10-11 00:56, Magnus Westerlund wrote:
MTU's are real bastard.
:-)

Especially for UDP applications that rarely has
built in any support for handling MTU discovery if the ICMP doesn't
work.
Are we talking about IPv4 here? In that case, path MTU discovery is  
pretty much impossible because the applications would have to receive  
the ICMP messages and adjust their behavior = every UDP app needs to  
implement PMTUD itself.
With IPv6 the IP layer takes care of all of this but obviously if  
there are no ICMP messages it won't work. However...
At least for TCP we at least have a solution that can be gradually
deployed in RFC 4821 "Packetization Layer Path MTU Discovery" that
doesn't rely on ICMP.
I don't see any reason why the IPv6 IP layer wouldn't be able to do  
RFC 4821.
However, I think we need to strive towards getting applications in line
and support MTU discovery.
No way. Application developers don't run networks, they tend to get  
this stuff wrong and then you'll forever supporting applications with  
broken network behavior that won't be upgraded for a decade.
It is silly for high-bit rate applications to
send all these small packet instead of at least descent sized packets
when possible.
So, is there any scope for a generic UDP echo process that would allow
PMTUD without ICMP messages?
That's what RFC 4821 does by trying different packet sizes and seeing  
which gets through.
For IPv4, an obvious method would be to send packets with DF=0 and  
hear from the other side how big the fragments are but that's not  
possible with IPv4.