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Re: a proposal to be subitted to teh ITU-T TSAG


[Just to IAB and IESG]

I remain very concerned that this is the tail wagging the dog.

Two separate issues:

	. the proposal itself, for which I have the same
	  concerns as Harald has expressed earlier (and
	  I don't believe are resolved by Scott's responses)

	. the fact that the ITU TSB liaison from the IETF is
	  creatign process for the IESG with an unspecified
	  timeout for comment, as opposed (say) to developing
	  it with the IESG and working it with the ITU.

Am I seriously alone in these concerns?  If so, I don't need
another battle of wills on my plate, and am happy to walk away
and let others live with (what I perceive to be) the consequences.
If not, I need some backup here.

Leslie.

Scott Bradner wrote: 
this is a draft of proposal that Gary Fishman & I have come up with to be
submitted to the ITU-T TSAG (the ITU-T's IESG) meeting next month

the proposed committee would be formed when we find a case where we
want to work together

maybe the test case could be megaco - the IETF would pass the token for
maintaing/updating megaco to the ITU but keep the megaco WG as
a way to ensure IETF involvement in the discussions

comments?

----

DISCUSSION
Scott Bradner, representing ISOC/IETF, and Gary Fishman, Chairman of TSAG,
have discussed this topic further and make the following proposal to the
ITU-T Study Group Chairmen's meeting and to TSAG.  It is proposed that the
TSAG Cooperation and Coordination Group affirm the desire to permit creation
of a single-document that is approved by both bodies and that a trial
be conducted to gain practical experience that can lead to written IETF
and ITU-T procedures.

PROPOSAL
1. Detailed procedures at this point in time are premature and a trial
   case(s) should be identified to gain practical experience first.

2. The Cooperation and Coordination Group, in conjunction with the ITU-T SG
   chairmen at TSAG, identify candidate topic(s), the selection of one or more
   being subject to approval by ISOC/IETF, to try out a cooperative process
   leading to approval by each organization of a standard published in a
   single document.

3. The first option for a process is where the work to produce a
   specification is done in one of the two organizations with cooperation and
   direct involvement of people from the other organization. The other
   organization producing and adopting a small specification with a normative
   reference to the main specification if needed.

4. This could include such techniques as the primary group sending a draft
   document to the other body to progress the work when necessary, joint
   meetings when/if convenient and necessary, sending of liaison
   representatives to each other's groups, etc.

5. IETF and ITU-T management create a Single Document Coordinating
   Committee (SDCC) of no more than a half-dozen people, such as
   representatives from the responsible IETF WG, from the IESG, the
   responsible ITU-T SG, TSAG and TSB.  The role of this Coordinating
   Committee would be to address procedural issues as they come up, not to
   address technical issues.

6. The Coordinating Committee shall report to the IESG and TSAG on progress
   and/or issues for resolution.

It is expected that procedural issues will arise e.g., related to
coordinating and synchronizing the two organizations’ approval
procedures, change control procedures, formatting rules, copyrights and
publication matters.  The Coordinating Committee will address these issues
on a regular basis as well as on an as-needed basis, seeking guidance from
their appropriate management or policy bodies and legal advisors of the two
organizations as necessary.